This piece is a great explainer on how the Trump/Musk regime is going to really destroy democracy. It’s about whether they defy the court orders that are coming fast and furious. Spoiler alert: they already have defied the order to turn back on the funding that Congress appropriated.
But JD Vance is doing more than just signaling the intent of the regime to cross this rubicon, he’s using his social media platform to misinform, indeed disinform, the MAGA mob into thinking that judges DON’T get to say whether laws are legitimate or not, which is the bedrock of our legal system. And once our legal system falls….
Remember, Article II, Section 1, Clause 8 of the U.S. Constitution specifies the exact wording of the oath that a president must take before entering office. The oath reads: “I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my Ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States.”
By taking this oath, a president pledges to uphold the Constitution and fulfill the responsibilities of the office, including enforcing and complying with the laws of United States as interpreted by the Supreme Court. Now the Constitution does not specifically provide a remedy when a president says he will not abide by that oath and instead do whatever he wants. But it is absurd to conclude that the Constitution would explicitly provide an oath of office without providing any remedy for dealing with someone who would blatantly take that oath and then disregard it.
Indeed, Ubi jus ibi remedium is a Latin maxim which means that where there is a wrong, there is a remedy. The maxim is based on the premise that where a man has a right, there must be means provided to him to ensure proper exercise or enjoyment of such rights. It is useless to imagine and think of a right without a remedy.
So what is the remedy for a president who thumbs his nose at his oath of office? Of course, impeachment and removal is probably the first thing that comes to mind. It could be applicable, but disregarding the presidential oath does not necessarily entail having committed any high crimes or misdemeanors. What then?
The Supreme Court, not the President, says what the law is and that’s the way it’s been since Marbury vs. Madison was decided in 1803. So under the Constitution the Supreme Court must be the body charged with finding that a president has deliberately and willfully disregarded his oath. Upon such a finding the Constitution at least permits and may require the Court to remove such a president from office. The Court need only publish an order directing the Chair of the Joint Chiefs of Staff to remove the now former commander in chief from office, willingly or unwillingly, whatever the case may require.
I say that taking an oath to defend the Constitution and immediately signing an order to violate one of its clauses is not only a high crime or misdemeanor, but it disqualifies him from holding the office according to Article 14 sec. 3, which seems to be self-executing.
Oh, if only that would happen. I sense, from other articles, that Chief Justice Roberts is concerned about the statement JD Vance made last weekend. Although often, as of late, Roberts has gone along with the other conservative justices, I believe deep down he is very much a jurist, and believes in the Constitution and Rule of Law. I also believe Justice Coney-Barret does as well. If that were true, they would join the more liberal justices in turning things around. I believe this is the only way a renegade administration will topple.
Hello, TLawrence, boy, oh boy, do I hope you are right about Roberts and Barrett, both of whom agreed that Trump was immune from prosecution. That ruling was just a part, albeit a large part, of what has gone wrong in our country. Elon Musk is a whole other issue. An unelected citizen, having press conferences in the Oval Office, describing how he is " bringing about democracy " for the American people, as his techies raid the computers of department after department, securing access to personal data of millions and millions and a teenager hire of Musk's hacked into the computer of our nuclear arsenal. What and who will stop Musk?
It’s totally possible - and likely - for Trump to ignore court orders. Who’s going to enforce them? The Supreme Court? Congress via impeachment?? HAHAHAHAHA!!! Good one!
The guardrails are gone folks. We have a dictator for as long as he lives. All we can hope for is that he won’t last long.
Two reasons why Trump moved his inauguration indoors: crowd size and security. He want's to last long and so do those tech bros (why do you think Elon carries his kid on his shoulders?).
Thing is...even elected officials (other than Trump in official capacity) are not above the law, and can be found in contempt, right? So, if an unelected destroyer like FElon is breaking the law over and over again, could he not be found liable for a felony? Or, have I got this all wrong?
“So under the Constitution the Supreme Court must be the body charged with finding that a president has deliberately and willfully disregarded his oath. Upon such a finding the Constitution at least permits and may require the Court to remove such a president from office. The Court need only publish an order directing the Chair of the Joint Chiefs of Staff to remove the now former commander in chief from office, willingly or unwillingly, whatever the case may require.”
I'm going to say the same thing I've been saying in other forums: we need to hit them in the wallet. This is not so easy but with concerted effort may happen. Boycotts are the first thing. Then, lobby other countries and provinces to cancel their Starlink contracts the way Ontario did. Ron Filipowski at the Midas Touch says that Tesla's stock price is critical to Musk's business and personal lives, and it's falling, as are sales in Europe. Book a test drive and don't show up. Do the same with Trump's hotels and golf courses. Patronize their competitors. I know this is hard because most of us can't afford this stuff in the first place, but pass it on and use your six degrees of separation. The angrier people get the more they will participate. And donate to Public Citizen, which is helping with some of the lawsuits.
Hello, Paula B, I agree with you completely about hitting them in the wallet because that is what they understand and that is the currency of their power. Indeed, if some of the billionaires, such as Bezos and Zuckerberg, etc had banded together against Trump/Musk, they could have stopped this impending tragedy of the loss of our republic. As a result, they would have had even more business and become even wealthier. Evidently, they were nerds, geeks, whatever unkind word you want to substitute as youths and never grew spines, testicles, whatever word you wish to substitute as men. They are cowards.
You are so right, Brenda! They would have been much more popular if they'd done the right thing. One thing that worries me is that the federal government is now giving Muck all kinds of contracts, so any boycott we institute is going to be less effective. They are all crooks.
Three words for this: Boycott AIR TRAVEL. We can all stay home for a year or two. Disney will suffer. Hyatt and Marriot will, too. So will rental car companies...but mostly, AIRLINES will pay the price. It also may not be such a bad idea with the state of the FAA, and Musks' takeover of same. That's my plan, anyway!
Thanks for explaining what Vance got wrong and why he wrote what he wrote. On the day Trump says “No judge controls me,” we need to launch a National General Strike.
Also, my favorite YouTube channel for political and other analysis, posted a video about Vance and the Constitution. I highly recommend subscribing to this channel…
Besides upstanding lawyers and law-abiding honorable (present and former) judges, here's a growing list of Profiles in Courage men, women, and advocacy groups who refuse to be cowed or kneel to the force of Trump/Musk/MAGA/Fox "News" intimidation:
I'll begin with Missouri's own Jess[ica] (à la John Lewis's "get in good trouble") Piper, then, in no particular order, Heather Cox Richardson, Rev. Mariann Edgar Budde, Ruth Ben-Ghait, Rachel Maddow, Lawrence O'Donnell, Chris Hayes, Jim Acosta, Jen Rubin And the Contrarians, Steve Brodner, Brian Tyler Cohen, Jonathan Bernstein, Jessica Craven, Annne Applebaum, Lucian Truscott IV, AOC, Chris Murphy, Elizabeth Warren, Tim Snyder, Robert B. Hubbell, Ben Meiseilas, Steve Schmidt, David Pepper,Judd Legum, Josh Marshall, Paul Krugman, Andy Borowitz, Jeff Danziger, Ann Telnaes,͏ ͏Will Bunch, Jake Tapper, Bennie Thompson, Liz Cheney, Adam Kinzinger; American Bar Association, Blue Missouri, Third Act, Democracy Forward, Public Citizen, Democracy Index, Democracy Docket, ACLU et al. And, as Joyce Vance says, "We're in this together"--or via Jess Piper, from rural Missouri: "Solidarity." FIGHT BACK! WE ARE NOT ALONE!
Thank you, again, for this clear-minded explanation Mr. Snell. It brings us back to reasoned thinking, and not to panicked thinking. That won't help us at all. It just makes people do rash things.
Now, they are bringing articles of impeachment against the judge. What high crime or misdemeanor did the judge commit in carrying out his Oath? Impeachment or Eos is all they know how to do unless you have Vought who is determined to traumatize us all.
How does DOJ just end an indictment/investigation against Eric Adams of NY? Would that not outrage the base that Adams is a democrat but isn't?
I'd like to know what Hegseth is doing about Somalia other than sending crates of booze to the critically injured soldiers and citizens, including woman, fighting with no help from us. They said they should have acted before Trump was sworn in. I believe Trump said he had defeated the ISIS caliphate. That's like arresting one drug cartel leader, when there are 100 behind him, and saying he's defeated the drug trade. They regroup or get invited to Camp David.
Today, I'm angry and I'm reading about the penny and the Kennedy Center when I want to know what I can do to help get this clown and his unelected, unvetted, Experian daddy CEO kid hired to access private data and oh, lots, lots more......
The people need to mobilize and march in the streets as never before. Let Congress and SCOTUS know the people actually give a shit, want them to find their spines, stand up and do their jobs. If we don’t, they’ll roll on us.
Vance knows the law, but he thinks Trump is above the law - since the SCOTUS practically gave him that. Now it appears John Roberts may be regretting that vote. Only SCOTUS can turn this around, but they have to get a case sent to them to do that, don't they? I am not a lawyer. I don't believe they can overturn a ruling without a case before them, can they?
TLawrence, SCOTUS rolled back protections for LGBTQ+ based on a HYPOTHETICAL case. None of the alleged " facts " were true, none of the alleged events happened, but SCOTUS didn't trouble themselves to ask pertinent questions. They saw the opportunity to roll back LGBTQ+ rights, and they jumped on it.
They have that Christian Nationalist agenda. They are playing politics and not basing their judgements on law or precedent. Although there are a couple judges I like (all female) the majority was placed there to do the party’s bidding. I don’t know what they’re afraid of, they are there for life so Trump can’t do anything to them - unless he has something on them.
This piece is a great explainer on how the Trump/Musk regime is going to really destroy democracy. It’s about whether they defy the court orders that are coming fast and furious. Spoiler alert: they already have defied the order to turn back on the funding that Congress appropriated.
But JD Vance is doing more than just signaling the intent of the regime to cross this rubicon, he’s using his social media platform to misinform, indeed disinform, the MAGA mob into thinking that judges DON’T get to say whether laws are legitimate or not, which is the bedrock of our legal system. And once our legal system falls….
Remember, Article II, Section 1, Clause 8 of the U.S. Constitution specifies the exact wording of the oath that a president must take before entering office. The oath reads: “I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my Ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States.”
By taking this oath, a president pledges to uphold the Constitution and fulfill the responsibilities of the office, including enforcing and complying with the laws of United States as interpreted by the Supreme Court. Now the Constitution does not specifically provide a remedy when a president says he will not abide by that oath and instead do whatever he wants. But it is absurd to conclude that the Constitution would explicitly provide an oath of office without providing any remedy for dealing with someone who would blatantly take that oath and then disregard it.
Indeed, Ubi jus ibi remedium is a Latin maxim which means that where there is a wrong, there is a remedy. The maxim is based on the premise that where a man has a right, there must be means provided to him to ensure proper exercise or enjoyment of such rights. It is useless to imagine and think of a right without a remedy.
So what is the remedy for a president who thumbs his nose at his oath of office? Of course, impeachment and removal is probably the first thing that comes to mind. It could be applicable, but disregarding the presidential oath does not necessarily entail having committed any high crimes or misdemeanors. What then?
The Supreme Court, not the President, says what the law is and that’s the way it’s been since Marbury vs. Madison was decided in 1803. So under the Constitution the Supreme Court must be the body charged with finding that a president has deliberately and willfully disregarded his oath. Upon such a finding the Constitution at least permits and may require the Court to remove such a president from office. The Court need only publish an order directing the Chair of the Joint Chiefs of Staff to remove the now former commander in chief from office, willingly or unwillingly, whatever the case may require.
I say that taking an oath to defend the Constitution and immediately signing an order to violate one of its clauses is not only a high crime or misdemeanor, but it disqualifies him from holding the office according to Article 14 sec. 3, which seems to be self-executing.
Oh, if only that would happen. I sense, from other articles, that Chief Justice Roberts is concerned about the statement JD Vance made last weekend. Although often, as of late, Roberts has gone along with the other conservative justices, I believe deep down he is very much a jurist, and believes in the Constitution and Rule of Law. I also believe Justice Coney-Barret does as well. If that were true, they would join the more liberal justices in turning things around. I believe this is the only way a renegade administration will topple.
Hello, TLawrence, boy, oh boy, do I hope you are right about Roberts and Barrett, both of whom agreed that Trump was immune from prosecution. That ruling was just a part, albeit a large part, of what has gone wrong in our country. Elon Musk is a whole other issue. An unelected citizen, having press conferences in the Oval Office, describing how he is " bringing about democracy " for the American people, as his techies raid the computers of department after department, securing access to personal data of millions and millions and a teenager hire of Musk's hacked into the computer of our nuclear arsenal. What and who will stop Musk?
Thank you for injecting some facts into all the hyperbole!
It’s totally possible - and likely - for Trump to ignore court orders. Who’s going to enforce them? The Supreme Court? Congress via impeachment?? HAHAHAHAHA!!! Good one!
The guardrails are gone folks. We have a dictator for as long as he lives. All we can hope for is that he won’t last long.
Two reasons why Trump moved his inauguration indoors: crowd size and security. He want's to last long and so do those tech bros (why do you think Elon carries his kid on his shoulders?).
Thing is...even elected officials (other than Trump in official capacity) are not above the law, and can be found in contempt, right? So, if an unelected destroyer like FElon is breaking the law over and over again, could he not be found liable for a felony? Or, have I got this all wrong?
Who has the authority to hold him accountable? His DOJ won’t.
See Richard Friedman’s comment above. It’s this:
“So under the Constitution the Supreme Court must be the body charged with finding that a president has deliberately and willfully disregarded his oath. Upon such a finding the Constitution at least permits and may require the Court to remove such a president from office. The Court need only publish an order directing the Chair of the Joint Chiefs of Staff to remove the now former commander in chief from office, willingly or unwillingly, whatever the case may require.”
I'm going to say the same thing I've been saying in other forums: we need to hit them in the wallet. This is not so easy but with concerted effort may happen. Boycotts are the first thing. Then, lobby other countries and provinces to cancel their Starlink contracts the way Ontario did. Ron Filipowski at the Midas Touch says that Tesla's stock price is critical to Musk's business and personal lives, and it's falling, as are sales in Europe. Book a test drive and don't show up. Do the same with Trump's hotels and golf courses. Patronize their competitors. I know this is hard because most of us can't afford this stuff in the first place, but pass it on and use your six degrees of separation. The angrier people get the more they will participate. And donate to Public Citizen, which is helping with some of the lawsuits.
Hello, Paula B, I agree with you completely about hitting them in the wallet because that is what they understand and that is the currency of their power. Indeed, if some of the billionaires, such as Bezos and Zuckerberg, etc had banded together against Trump/Musk, they could have stopped this impending tragedy of the loss of our republic. As a result, they would have had even more business and become even wealthier. Evidently, they were nerds, geeks, whatever unkind word you want to substitute as youths and never grew spines, testicles, whatever word you wish to substitute as men. They are cowards.
BTW, just saw your profile: teachers rock!!
You are so right, Brenda! They would have been much more popular if they'd done the right thing. One thing that worries me is that the federal government is now giving Muck all kinds of contracts, so any boycott we institute is going to be less effective. They are all crooks.
Three words for this: Boycott AIR TRAVEL. We can all stay home for a year or two. Disney will suffer. Hyatt and Marriot will, too. So will rental car companies...but mostly, AIRLINES will pay the price. It also may not be such a bad idea with the state of the FAA, and Musks' takeover of same. That's my plan, anyway!
There's a new Election Truth Alliance estimating Harris would have gotten 70% of the vote without the Republican interference.
https://www.reddit.com/r/somethingiswrong2024/comments/1imidko/she_would_have_had_somewhere_around_the_70_of_the/
It matches with https://www.thenumbersarewrong2024.com/
This is super-interesting, Joy. Thanks for sharing!
Thanks for explaining what Vance got wrong and why he wrote what he wrote. On the day Trump says “No judge controls me,” we need to launch a National General Strike.
Also, my favorite YouTube channel for political and other analysis, posted a video about Vance and the Constitution. I highly recommend subscribing to this channel…
https://youtu.be/1JcAj5-ePtw
Can't say they haven't been telling us all along what they are planning
Besides upstanding lawyers and law-abiding honorable (present and former) judges, here's a growing list of Profiles in Courage men, women, and advocacy groups who refuse to be cowed or kneel to the force of Trump/Musk/MAGA/Fox "News" intimidation:
I'll begin with Missouri's own Jess[ica] (à la John Lewis's "get in good trouble") Piper, then, in no particular order, Heather Cox Richardson, Rev. Mariann Edgar Budde, Ruth Ben-Ghait, Rachel Maddow, Lawrence O'Donnell, Chris Hayes, Jim Acosta, Jen Rubin And the Contrarians, Steve Brodner, Brian Tyler Cohen, Jonathan Bernstein, Jessica Craven, Annne Applebaum, Lucian Truscott IV, AOC, Chris Murphy, Elizabeth Warren, Tim Snyder, Robert B. Hubbell, Ben Meiseilas, Steve Schmidt, David Pepper,Judd Legum, Josh Marshall, Paul Krugman, Andy Borowitz, Jeff Danziger, Ann Telnaes,͏ ͏Will Bunch, Jake Tapper, Bennie Thompson, Liz Cheney, Adam Kinzinger; American Bar Association, Blue Missouri, Third Act, Democracy Forward, Public Citizen, Democracy Index, Democracy Docket, ACLU et al. And, as Joyce Vance says, "We're in this together"--or via Jess Piper, from rural Missouri: "Solidarity." FIGHT BACK! WE ARE NOT ALONE!
Thank you, again, for this clear-minded explanation Mr. Snell. It brings us back to reasoned thinking, and not to panicked thinking. That won't help us at all. It just makes people do rash things.
Now, they are bringing articles of impeachment against the judge. What high crime or misdemeanor did the judge commit in carrying out his Oath? Impeachment or Eos is all they know how to do unless you have Vought who is determined to traumatize us all.
How does DOJ just end an indictment/investigation against Eric Adams of NY? Would that not outrage the base that Adams is a democrat but isn't?
I'd like to know what Hegseth is doing about Somalia other than sending crates of booze to the critically injured soldiers and citizens, including woman, fighting with no help from us. They said they should have acted before Trump was sworn in. I believe Trump said he had defeated the ISIS caliphate. That's like arresting one drug cartel leader, when there are 100 behind him, and saying he's defeated the drug trade. They regroup or get invited to Camp David.
Today, I'm angry and I'm reading about the penny and the Kennedy Center when I want to know what I can do to help get this clown and his unelected, unvetted, Experian daddy CEO kid hired to access private data and oh, lots, lots more......
I heard that BILLIONAIRE Peter Theil was in on everything and that he is friends with JD Vance.
Tracey, that is correct.
The people need to mobilize and march in the streets as never before. Let Congress and SCOTUS know the people actually give a shit, want them to find their spines, stand up and do their jobs. If we don’t, they’ll roll on us.
The hour is late. We must take it back…
Vance knows the law, but he thinks Trump is above the law - since the SCOTUS practically gave him that. Now it appears John Roberts may be regretting that vote. Only SCOTUS can turn this around, but they have to get a case sent to them to do that, don't they? I am not a lawyer. I don't believe they can overturn a ruling without a case before them, can they?
TLawrence, SCOTUS rolled back protections for LGBTQ+ based on a HYPOTHETICAL case. None of the alleged " facts " were true, none of the alleged events happened, but SCOTUS didn't trouble themselves to ask pertinent questions. They saw the opportunity to roll back LGBTQ+ rights, and they jumped on it.
They have that Christian Nationalist agenda. They are playing politics and not basing their judgements on law or precedent. Although there are a couple judges I like (all female) the majority was placed there to do the party’s bidding. I don’t know what they’re afraid of, they are there for life so Trump can’t do anything to them - unless he has something on them.
Thank you for this defining and confirming article with details and crucial information. We need and appreciate you so much.